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Posted by ganstaman cyclonechess.com 5/04/2008 08:11:43 Play online chess	Subject: Puzzle 283 Message: Ok, the puzzle on the homepage at the time of me writing this (search for puzzle number 283 here: gameknot.com ) White to move, mate in 4. I won't spoil the solution given, as it is brilliant seeming to me. But how can black spoil white's plan of Qh4-(h or e)7-b7#? I can see black delaying the journey by 1 move, so it would be mate in 4. What did I miss, if anything?
Posted by heinzkat cyclonechess.com 5/04/2008 08:21:53 Play online chess	I think the answer is Message: 1. Qh4 Rh1!
Posted by sf115 cyclonechess.com 5/04/2008 08:35:09 Play online chess	Message: If 1. Qh4 Rh1 white either: 2. Qxh1 a1=Q 3. Qh7 Qxa6+ 4. bxa6 b1=Q 5. Qb7++ which is a move slower than the actual solution. OR 2. continue with the original plan with 2. Qe7 Rh8+ 3. Nd8 Rh7 (3...Rxd8 also slows down whites mate) 4. Qb7+ Rxb7 5. axb7++ which is also in 5 moves. So there is only a mate in 5, which is slower than the actual solution ——— So Holds Lead in Biel, as Negi Gets on the Board — Wesley So of the Philippines drew his Round 4 game Thursday in the Biel Chess Festival, which was enough for him to hold on to the lead. He has 3 points. Most of the other games also ended in draws, with the exception of the contest between Dmitry Andreikin of Russia and David Howell of Britain. In that game, Andreikin found a new idea in a well-known variation of the English opening. Surprised, Howell struggled and quickly fell into trouble. Andreikin’s rooks penetrated to the seventh rank, after which there was little Howell could do and he resigned after only 30 moves. Andreikin is tied for second with Fabiano Caruana of Italy and Evgeny Tomashevsky of Russia. They each have 2.5 points. Once ...
Posted by ganstaman cyclonechess.com 5/04/2008 09:50:31 Play online chess	Message: Ah, that seems to do it. Thanks. ——— Two Draws and a Blunder in Dortmund — One of the eternal frustrations of chess is that a well played game can be lost with one careless move. Shakhriyar Mamedyarov of Azerbaijan, the No. 6 chess player in the world, was reminded of this on Wednesday at the elite Sparkassen Chess-Meeting in Dortmunt, Germany. In Round 6, Mamedyarov was White against Arkadij Naiditsch of Germany. Mamedyarov got a clear edge out of the opening and had his opponent under pressure for much of the game. Naiditsch defended well and the game seemed to heading for a draw when Mamedyarov blundered, taking a knight with his rook that was defended by Naiditsch’s queen. As chess blunders go, it was not exactly colossal, but ...
Posted by lighttotheright cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 03:53:48 Play online chess	Message: There is an alternate solution that is not accounted for by this puzzle. This kind of thing irritates me. It turns out that my first choice was in fact correct, but the puzzle said I made a mistake. Once you know the solution, it is easy to see that my alternate path works because mine is based on the same principles that are used in the given one. It's still mate in four, but why are alternate solutions unaccounted for? I thought that problem was fixed long ago. ——— Shankland Is US Junior Chess Champion — Samuel Shankland, an 18-year-old international master, survived a three-way playoff on Tuesday to win the United States junior chess championship. Shankland was the No. 2 seed, but he beat Ray Robson, the top seed and a chess grandmaster, in an Armageddon game to claim the title. As there were three players tied for first, there were two playoff games. Robson, by virtue of having the better tie-breaker scores, met the winner of the first game. In that one, Shankland beat Parker Zhao. The playoff involved long Armageddon games, just like the one used at the U.S. Chess Championship earlier this year. Shankland and Zhao, each chess player secretly bid on how much time, up to ...
Posted by heinzkat cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 04:22:15 Play online chess	That problem was fixed long ago Message: Lighttotheright, I think you're wrong here though - puzzle 283 has only one solution (for mate in four). ——— Krush Is US Women's Chess Champion; Playoff Will Decide US Junior — Irina Krush, 26, won the United States Women’s Championship on Monday by defeating Abby Marshall, 19, in the final round of the chess tournament. Krush finished with 8 points. It is Krush’s third title. She previously won in 1998 and 2007. For winning this time, she earned $16,000. Krush’s principal rival, Anna Zatonskih, 32, the 2009 champion, who was tied with Krush before the final round, could only draw against Sabina Foisor, 20. She finished with 7.5 points and tied for second with Tatev Abrahamyan, 22, who beat Katerina Rohonyan, 26. Zatonskih and Abrahamyan each earned $10,500. Krush’s win over Marshall was not easy. Marshall, playing in her first U.S. Chess Championship, had ...
Posted by lighttotheright cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 04:33:40 Play online chess	Message: The alternate 1. Nd8 works and is confirmed. It is mate in four just like the given solution. ——— Mamedyarov Leads in Dortmund — Shakhriyar Mamedyarov of Azerbaijan took over the lead of the elite Sparkassen Chess-Meeting tournament in Germany on Sunday after he drew his game while his co-leader, Ruslan Ponomariov of Ukraine, lost. Mamedyarov has 3 points after four rounds, Ponomariov has 2.5, Le Quang Liem of Vietnam, who beat Ponomariov, has 2, and Vladimir Kramnik of Russia, the defending chess champion, Peter Leko of Hungary and Arkadij Naiditsch of Germany are tied for last with 1.5 points each. The standings are startling as Kramnik, Leko and Naiditsch are all previous champions in Dortmund, while the top three players have never won there. Mamedyarov faced Vladimir Kramnik of Russia, the defending chess ...
Posted by lighttotheright cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 04:38:41 Play online chess	Message: Heinzkat -- I'm not wrong. 1. Nd8 does work. The problem is that no computer can solve this particular problem from four moves out. The computer checking the solutions is wrong. Once you input the solution, the computer suddenly sees the solution at 2 or 3 moves out depending upon the program that you use. This particular puzzle is an anti-computer one.
Posted by heinzkat cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 04:47:30 Play online chess	Lighttotheright! Message: This is the interesting part of the puzzle, which is not covered in puzzle #283, since the puzzle application didn't support underpromotions of the opposite side back then. After 1. Nd8? [if I may boldly give it a ?] c2 2. Qc1 b1=B! Black is stalemated and there can be no mate in four. After 1. Nb4 however, 1. ... c2 2. Qc1 b1=B 3. Nd3! exd3 4. Qh1, it IS mate in four :-)
Posted by chessnovice cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 04:48:12 Play online chess	... Message: Sometimes puzzle makers don't have solutions entered entirely. Human error is prone to omissions. If you find an alternate solution, you're able to enter it. Nothing to necessarily get irritated about, I think.
Posted by heinzkat cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 04:55:26 Play online chess	Also... Message: Remember GameKnot does no checking of the puzzle at all - the puzzle application merely checks if all variations end in checkmate. If so, the puzzle is 'approved' 'correct' (twice '', ah well) an can be put up for others to solve. As you can see on the puzzle page, a lot of the puzzles still have some hiatuses then. If you think 1. Nd8 mates in four too, 'prove it'! You can do so by browsing to puzzle #283, hover over 'Options' in the right corner and click 'Alt. solution...'. This will give you the option to prove there is another way to play, that results in mate in at most the same number of moves as the original author. If all variations are correct, you can save the puzzle too, and the puzzle has been 'improved'.
Posted by lighttotheright cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 04:58:36 Play online chess	Message: 1. Nd8 c2 2. Qc1 b1=B 3. Nd5 Qb2 (or any move) 4. Nc7# It is forced checkmate. There is no stalemate with my solution. The alternate is confirmed, and not seen by computer at four moves out.
Posted by lighttotheright cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 05:00:17 Play online chess	Message: 1. Nd8 c2 2. Qc1 b1=B 3. Nd5 Bb2 (or any move) 4. Nc7# Sorry I made a slight error in copying the line. This is correct.
Posted by heinzkat cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 05:01:19 Play online chess	2. ... b1=B! Message: Not 2. ... b1=Q. Please re-evaluate your assessments. :-) (note that I hadn't noticed the b1=B solution either. A nice brilliancy by Ado Kraemer)
Posted by heinzkat cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 05:02:30 Play online chess	Lighttotheright Message: 3. ... Bb2 is not possible in the intended line! It's 2. ... b1=B, not 2. ... bxc1=B.
Posted by lighttotheright cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 05:03:18 Play online chess	Message: I did it again. 1. Nd8 c2 2. Qc1 b1=B 3. Ne6 Bb2 (or any move) 4. Nc7# Those knight moves can get confusing. I think this is correct now.
Posted by lighttotheright cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 05:06:00 Play online chess	Message: Heinskat look at the position. The key to the solutiion is the knight path. The Queen sac is to block any defence by black. The solution is very simple. 1. Nb4 and 1. Nd8 both work.
Posted by heinzkat cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 05:06:23 Play online chess	Note that in your line... Message: 3. ... Bb2 is illegal. In fact, after 3. Ne6, all Black's moves are illegal - it is stalemate!
Posted by heinzkat cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 05:09:59 Play online chess	OK... with a diagram then... Message: After 1. Nd8 c2 2. Qc1 b1=B 3. Ne6 It is Black to move. Do you see any legal ones? Interesting how Ado Kraemer can still keep us busy with his brilliant problems, 36 years after he died.
Posted by lighttotheright cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 05:14:36 Play online chess	Message: OK heinzkat. You threw me for a loop with b1. I was thinking about the c1 square. But even with b1=B, it is still checkmate in four. 1. Nd8 b1=b 2. Qxc3 and my solution still works.
Posted by heinzkat cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 05:21:11 Play online chess	Well... Message: 1. Nd8 c2 2. Qc1 b1=B is the line that makes mate in four impossible. 1. Nd8 b1=B like you give in this last post, perfectly mates in four - but there's a difference. Carefully check the notations right from the beginning of this thread, I think I haven't messed up any of them...
Posted by lighttotheright cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 05:21:54 Play online chess	Message: OK...It is still not stalemate. But it would be a mate in 5 instead. 1. Nd8 c2 2. Qc1 b1=B 3. Qxc2 and it is not stalemate. ...but it does take an extra turn to get the knight to c7.
Posted by lighttotheright cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 05:24:17 Play online chess	Message: Sorry for some of the copy mistakes. My copy function on my computer is not working. I have to reboot my whole computer to correct the problem.
Posted by heinzkat cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 05:24:20 Play online chess	Exactly... Message: And therefore, 1. Nd8 is an incorrect try. Mate in five is possible in many ways - there is only one correct starting move to mate in four.
Posted by lighttotheright cyclonechess.com 5/05/2008 05:58:50 Play online chess	Message: Well, it looked correct to me at the time. And my computer was not cooperating with me either!
Posted by chessnovice cyclonechess.com 5/06/2008 13:55:37 Play online chess	... Message: b1=B is pretty clever! Indeed, prolongs the Nd8 line by one move. I wouldn't worry about not considering that though, since I doubt that very many people really would.
Posted by bogg cyclonechess.com 5/06/2008 15:13:15 Play online chess	In case anyone else has the ... Message: same problem that I had. The reason that 2. ... b1=B doesn't cook 1.Nb4 and does cook 1. Nd4 and 1. Nd8 is because after 1.Nd4 White has 3. Nd3 ed: 4. Qh1++. Took me a while to see the tree within the forest. CTC
Posted by heinzkat cyclonechess.com 5/07/2008 01:30:09 Play online chess	chessnovice Message: Obviously the composer did consider it :) bogg: indeed, see my post above too, 5/05/2008 04:47:30
Posted by chessnovice cyclonechess.com 5/07/2008 01:44:28 Play online chess	hienzkat Message: True. But if you can't trust the composer, who can you trust?
Posted by bogg cyclonechess.com 5/07/2008 06:35:06 Play online chess	heinzkat Message: Missed that post. Would have saved me some time had I noticed it. CTC